Comments on: Detention and Torture: Are We Still Free, or Not? http://www.10zenmonkeys.com/2006/10/23/detention-and-torture/ Your source for technology culture, internet phenomena, politics, interviews and entertainment Fri, 25 Jul 2008 01:46:19 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1 By: RU Sirius http://www.10zenmonkeys.com/2006/10/23/detention-and-torture/#comment-208 RU Sirius Wed, 25 Oct 2006 19:58:36 +0000 http://www.10zenmonkeys.com/?p=44#comment-208 I agree with you, basically. I was exploring a specific thing, how this affects citizens and the assumptions that people in the media have made about that. But how this affects everybody else is also a matter of grave concern. The first Bush actually went into a country (Panama), extracted the leader (Noriega), and then threw him into a US prison. Noriega was a fuck, of course, (he was OUR fuck) but the arrogance of that one still astonishes me. I've always assumed the thing between George The First and Noriega must have been a coke deal gone bad. RU I agree with you, basically. I was exploring a specific thing, how this affects citizens and the assumptions that people in the media have made about that. But how this affects everybody else is also a matter of grave concern. The first Bush actually went into a country (Panama), extracted the leader (Noriega), and then threw him into a US prison. Noriega was a fuck, of course, (he was OUR fuck) but the arrogance of that one still astonishes me.

I’ve always assumed the thing between George The First and Noriega must have been a coke deal gone bad.

RU

]]> By: Perry de Havilland http://www.10zenmonkeys.com/2006/10/23/detention-and-torture/#comment-202 Perry de Havilland Wed, 25 Oct 2006 14:15:43 +0000 http://www.10zenmonkeys.com/?p=44#comment-202 This one is a 'biggie' but whilst as Americans I can see why you are more concerned with how if affects Americans, I do find the lack of concern about the effects on non-US subjects a bit disconcerting given the propensity of American courts to try and apply their laws extra-territorially. As providing 'material support' can mean damn near anything, if for example I was providing money to a lawyer here in the UK who was opposing (say) the extradition of someone to the USA who the US authorities had accused of being a terrorist, could the US government decide that *I* have provided 'material support' to the Bad Guys? If so, I would do well to cancel that holiday to Florida or trip to see friends in New York. This one is a ‘biggie’ but whilst as Americans I can see why you are more concerned with how if affects Americans, I do find the lack of concern about the effects on non-US subjects a bit disconcerting given the propensity of American courts to try and apply their laws extra-territorially.

As providing ‘material support’ can mean damn near anything, if for example I was providing money to a lawyer here in the UK who was opposing (say) the extradition of someone to the USA who the US authorities had accused of being a terrorist, could the US government decide that *I* have provided ‘material support’ to the Bad Guys? If so, I would do well to cancel that holiday to Florida or trip to see friends in New York.

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